Govinda Devi Dasi: This is truly beautiful. It shows the early hardships and austerities our beloved Master willingly endured for the sake of spreading the movement of Lord Chaitanya. It touches my heart deep!
Letter to: Sripad Narayana Maharaja,
10 April, 1965
c/o Gopal P. Agarwal
415 North Main Street Apt 111
BUTLER, Pennsylvania, U.S.A.
Tridandi Goswami A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami
Sripad Narayana Maharaja,
Please accept my dandavats, and also convey my dandavats to Muni Maharaja and of all the other Vaisnavas.
By the mercy of Srila Prabhupada, I have had so much work to do since I came to the West that although I was thinking of writing you a letter, up until now I could not write. I came to stay here for one month, but if I can stay here longer, the work will be done well. Here they are naturally attracted to Christianity, but they also like to listen to me.
Since I came here, I have been lecturing everyday either in a church, school, college, club, or society. Their English is a little difficult for me to understand because they pronounce words differently, and our pronunciation of English is difficult for them to understand. But the work has not stopped because of this. They don’t dislike my English.
In the Butler Eagle Newspaper, which is one of the largest publications, they like my English, and together with my photograph they have printed this article: “In Fluent English Devotee of Hindu Cult Explains Commission To Visit West-A slight brown man in faded orange drapes wearing white bathing shoes stepped out of a compact car yesterday and into Butler YMCA to attend a meeting. He is A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami, a messenger from India to the peoples of the West. A Hindu by faith, the learned teacher has translated Biblical literature such as Srimad-Bhagavatam into English from ancient Sanskrit. He is now fulfilling a mission given to him by his spiritual master to enlighten English speaking people about their relationship with God.”
I have explained in detail a short life history. Under my photograph, I wrote (in large letters): AMBASSADOR OF BHAKTIYOGA “Chanting the holy name of God is among the religious practices of A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami, who arrived on Monday for a month’s stay in the Butler area, as a ‘Missionary in the West.’ Pictured in the apartment of his sponsor in the United States, Gopal Agarwal, the Swamiji is residing in the YMCA, and cooking his own meals at the Agarwal home.
‘Every culture has religion,’ he says. ‘We are all engaged in service of some sort; the highest service is to the Supreme Lord.’ The scholar-teacher has translated sixty volumes of Sanskrit scripture into English. Now, seventy years old, the appointed ‘missionary’ to the United States, was educated in India up to a Bachelor of Arts. He became a disciple in 1933, and received instructions until the death of his leader in 1936. He has severed all family ties, forsaking wife, children, and a business in Calcutta, to follow his beliefs.”
To cross the Atlantic Ocean took ten days. This great sea is usually full of storms and fog and is very disturbing. But by the mercy of Krsna, there was no disturbance. The captain of the ship, the main officer, told me, ” This kind of quiet Atlantic I have never seen in my life.” I told them that this is only by Krsna’s mercy, nothing else. After the troublesome storm in the Arabian Sea, I knew that if I had had to face a storm like that again, I would die.
I am thinking that the preaching will be very good here. I am lecturing-some days for an hour and some days for one half-hour. The people of America are now tasting some new thing. This is the first time I have come to a foreign country, crossing twelve thousand miles. All here are outcastes (not followers of the varnasrama-dharma system) yet I am never afraid to speak in front of them. For the first time in my life I delivered a speech in a church. The main thing is that I am alone and I am in my old age. Because of this, crossing twelve thousand miles in a ship, I became very sick.
I crossed the Bay of Bengal, the Indian Ocean, the Arabian Sea, the Red Sea, the Mediterranean Sea, and the Atlantic Ocean. I passed through Asia, Europe and Africa. I crossed these oceans and seas and became so sick. Due to my request, they served me vegetarian meals on the ship, yet I could not take them. I fasted continuously for eight to ten days. The pitta (fire) increased so much in my body thus I suffered terribly from colic pain.
Afterwards, the captain of the ship purchased an electric stove for me in Port Said. I then cooked for myself and took prasada. If they hadn’t managed this stove for me, maybe there would have been no possibility of me reaching America. I could have died on the way, but instead Krsna mercifully brought me here. Why Krsna has brought me here, only He knows.
It is very expensive here. One room I found in the YMCA has a weekly rent of fifty-five rupees. This is a very, very expensive country. The laborers earn more than gentlemen in India. They are paid eighty to eighty-five or ninety rupees daily. Everybody has a motor car, since all the offices and markets are very far away. Every civilized person has one car, which costs ten thousand rupees each. In India that same car would costs fifty thousand rupees. People drive the cars themselves, they have no paid drivers to do it for them. Nor do they keep servants.
There are lakhs and lakhs of motor cars. When I came from New York to Butler, I saw that on two lanes, for five hundred miles there was a solid line of cars. There was no need of electric lights because there were so many cars. At night in the city the shops are lit up and it appears like daytime. There are so many bridges and flyovers (overpasses) that the cars never need to pass each other on narrow roads. Every motor car is generally going not less than fifty miles per hour. Many houses are twenty-five to thirty stories high. In this neighborhood, there are cottages built on small plots. The people are very civilized, but they are ugra (high tempered, not polite or humble).
Today in New York, the Pope came. On television, everyone saw this. Television is an amazing thing. Just staying in one room, they can watch how the whole world is going on, and how they are all corresponding with each other. “The days are passed in vain work and the nighttimes in sleep.” Here people are generally non-vegetarian. Without meat they can’t eat anything. I have been taking muri (puffed rice) and peanuts with mustard oil. Somewhere I found mustard oil. Everything is available, but the price is so high. I purchased two hundred and fifty grams of mustard oil for five rupees. I had to travel to a shop twenty miles distant to get it. If you want to come to this country, reply to me.
Swami Maharaja
Taking so much troubles Srila Prabhupada, you came and gave us pure Krishna Consciousness.
How then can we tolerate it being all in vain, because some foolish disciples thought it wise to disobey your instructions and do their own thing?
ALL GLORIES TO HIS DIVINE GRACE A.C.BHAKTIVEDANTA SWAMI SRILA PRABHUPADA!–Yes Krshnapriya Devi dasi I very much like your statement. Reading SRILA PRABHUPADA’s letter actually brought one single tear to my eye.So much pain and struggle to save us–meat-eating losers that He did not even personally know. I can never repay such mercy-but I will try my best. How ISKCON was derailed by demons is just part of SRI KRSNA’s plan,but SRILA PRABHUPADA’s desire can never be thwarted. LORD CAITANYA and SRILA PRABHUPADA will triumph–You can bet on that. Even though we do not gamble–THIS IS A SURE THING! JAI RADHE!
Devaki Nandana Prabhu could you try to explain how it may be that Krishna planned ISKCON to derail (a part of His plan?) To me it looks like complete nonsens. I could ( and do) accept the inconceivable nature of Krishna knowing ahead what will happen to ISKCON, but have a real problem to grasp how He was planning it? You mean He have made everything “henceforward” so we do not have to worry about our free will and responsibillity?! Ritiviks You are so dramatically self deluding. Every initiated disciple of Srila Prabhupada (from 1966-1977) WAS AND IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ISKCON AND WHAT HAD HAPPENED TO IT, it is logical consequence of the personal commitment which contitutes a real initiation. After such initiation naturally the disciple becomes a menial servant of his master, his possesions and mission included. Except merely a handful of real fighters most of the disicples of Srila Prabhupada failed to protect ISKCON. I don’t say I am better than You, not at all, but we can’t be lunatics now anymore, and the ritvik concotion which is nothing but another ramification of this impersonal approach will NOT help us to make something substantial about all of this.
Dear Bhakta Jarek, thanks for your greetings from Poland! Seems the devotees are quite happy there and they never experienced – fallen ISKCON gurus!
Naturally we consider that everywhere else the situation is similar. We recently visited Rocana Dasa at his beautiful country residence in Canada to find out why he is so aggressive towards ritvik devotees?
Soon it became evident that he never met devotees who became victims of fallen gurus. How someone can join in a conversation without direct experience? Just having an internet access and reading Vaishnava forums doesnt make one an expert of understanding what realy happened. On location, field work is required to get a complete overview.
Checkout countries where ISKCON gurus were falling down and what happened afterwards. What happened with the lives of all those betrayed devotees? Although posing as expert, pretending to know everything, Rocana never left his stately home to find out what happened at places with dozens of fallen gurus.
41 fallen ISKCON gurus is not peanuts! There might be “idyllic worlds”, like Poland, untroubled by “gurus” leaving with temple savings and female disciple. But why these uninvolved devotees are teaching now in a most aggressive way that “ritvikism is madness”? Aren’t 41 fallen ISKCON gurus realy madness?
Many countries with 8-10 fallen gurus never recovered. People lost faith and joined somewhere else, never want to be reminded of ISKCON and even worse, Srila Prabhupada. In sum, ritvikism was not invented by meanwhile ten thousand betrayed devotees, vice versa, there was/is epidemic fall-down of ISKCON gurus leaving behind trails of destruction.
Prabhupada came to US in order to establish the essence of vedic knowledge (ripened fruit of vedic knowledge). ISKCON’s present policy to have fallen gurus (Christianity never had a fallen Lord Jesus) as kind of peccadillo has no right to exist in Prabhupada’s understanding of guru-tattva. Would Polish devotees tolerate fallen gurus? I’m 100% sure – they won’t.
Stupid Kali chela bhakta Jarek was serving his “FISKCON” apprenticeship in West Berlin and Amsterdam in the eighties, and my Kali FISKCON guru has also “fall down”(how an imposter guru may fall down anyway?). So, I don’t know what are you talking about mataji. The rest of your comment is just another emotional talk and this is what I do refer to saying “lunatics”. You are modifying the philosophy to fit your nice in deed emotions, but please excuse me I am not interested in but another sentimental movement anymore. The answer to your last question is; o yes the polish isconites love fallen gurus. Some names? Indradyumna with his dancing girls, Krishna kshetra das with his sleepy Oxford style nonsens lectures, Trivikrama swami talking lies like from a prompter(open your eyes they are all fallen, they have never been gurus, it is all mayas trick and nothing more, the only guru since the departure of H.D.G. Bhaktisidhanta Goswami was and still is through His vani H.D.G. A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada Maharaj). The polish kali chelas are in love with fallen gurus, they are, don’t worry. However the fact is that there are not ritviks here in Poland, at least I have never come across them, and somewho I tell you honestly I do prefer ritviks over the iskconties million times more, though I do pay my respect to both parties from a far.
Those who are following ritvik or ritvikism, do they consider themselves to be a disciple
of Srila Prabhupada or simply a follower of him and his teaching ?
Hare Krsna.
Hare Rama Bhakta Jarek,
please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
You stated in your post:
“I don’t say I am better than You, not at all, but we can’t be lunatics now anymore, and the ritvik concotion which is nothing but another ramification of this impersonal approach will NOT help us to make something substantial about all of this.”
If you say the Ritvik order given in the July 9th 1977 letter is impersonal, you are the greatest fool, because you follow the conclusion of Suhotra Swami, who is another bogus Guru.
Srila Prabhupada clearly gave the Ritvik order in the July 9th 1977 letter and this was now even confirmed by his personal servant:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nrqw0xfOiB8&feature=g-all-u
“These are my memories of the main pastimes that happened in Swami Srila Prabhupada’s garden in Sri Vrindavan Dhama when I was personally serving him in 1977.
For more you can Google my name and/or report called “On My Behalf” which is on many websites. Jagat Guru Srila Prabhupada Ki Jaya! He lives forever and the follower lives with him. \o/”
People like Jarek, who pose as devotees while calling Srila Prabhupadas direct Orders an “Impersonal Approach” the the only reason ISKCON failed…
With kind regards,
Bhakta Robin
Wystarczyło, że bhakta Jarek nauczał mnie przez kilka dni w 2010r., i popełniłem bardzo poważną obrazę wobec Śrila Prabhupada.
It was enough that a devotee Jarek taught me a few days in 2010., And committed a very serious offense to Srila Prabhupada.
Bhakta Robin the next generation of ritviks will have to change hundreds of Srila Prabhupada verses or quotations in His Divine Graces books where either Srila Prabhupada directly , Lord Caitanya or other Acharyas order everyone to become guru, not this or that guru but guru. Guru means perfect but certainly not a concocted self made mad ritivk. In fact you are allready changing His books and vani making all kinds of nonsens distinctions in the subject of sikha and diksha showing that you don’t get the point at all. You are in very similiar way like the FISKCON freaks overemphasise the formal diksha as preliminary condition to chant the Hare Krishna Maha Mantra, even so that you whimsically and cheatingly dare to change the written and absolutely clear eternal law of disciplic succession as given and shown per personal example by His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada. Thus you destroy what is left over from the FISKCON disaster. Now two stipud camps of cheaters will preach the alleged opposite views but the result will be definite stopping of the Yuga Dharma. And to be clear bhakta Jarek is not calling any order of Srila Prabhupada with any names, your conclussion only shows how lunatic liers you ritviks are! Did you at least tried to read Rocana prabhus Defeat of Ritvki vada? There is nothing like the “Final Order” of Srila Prabhupada pertaining to the alleged posthumous ritivik diksha, it is just an illusion which is borm out of our stubborn resistance and disobedience. By the way you may easily omit the sophisticated courtesy when calling me in fact an aparadhi in the end of you fanatical and absolutely free from philosophy (as usual) comment, let us fight like seekers of highest truth and not like liars or cheap comedians please. According to the Nectar of Instruction to the kanishta or not properly initiated bhakta (like Jarek) we are obliged just to pay respect in our mind, and nothing more, so there is no need to make a show and theatre with “humble obeisances” and then offend me bhakta Robin. Just be brave and do name things directly, if you can! If we do simply follow the Nectar of Instruction then one day our hearts will be henceforward clear and free from this kind of sahajiya cheating propensity. There is by the way no one except ourselves to be blamed for FISKCON, so the reform must beginn in our own hearts, but not by creating a new nonsens religion, as the Church of Ritvik definitely is.
Hare Rama,
please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
Well as I understand people can be Shiksha Gurus and not Diksha Gurus.
What kind of offender are you? I do not even continue to read your offensive statements, because you call the July 9th 1977 letter a “concocted self made mad ritivk”
Read that letter:
http://theharekrishnamovement.wordpress.com/category/july-9th-letter/
And then either follow it or go to hell.
Why do you even come here, this is a Ritvik Website?!
Go off to take initiation from one of the bogus ISKCON Gurus and go to hell with them, if you call Srila Prabhupadas direct order given in the July 9th 1977 letter “concocted”!
Calm down Robert. i come to the site simply to fight for the truth. in the same way i do fight while alone singing Hare Krishna on streets and distributing Srila Prabhupada message and warning people from FISCKOn. How can I take initiation from them? Are you completely out of your mind? I am happy to see your real fanatical angry face. How to hell You impose upon me the ritvik vada delirium interpretation of the July 9 letter which I did not mentioned at all? It is funny to see how ISKCON freaks see and hate me as a ritvik, and the ritviks hate me as an ISKCONite, it means you are both on mental plane boy. Good luck to you, though I am sure it will be hard for you in the end for carelessly promoting a new kali yuga cheating belief. I do belief most of the ritviks have a very nice and devoted sentiment to Srila Prabhupada, however this is not about sentiments, we have to follow the Guru, sadhu and śastra. and nothing more.
Jeżeli bhaktowie uczący się intonować i słuchać maha-mantrę Hare Krsna są demonami, to:
Kim są demony?
Uczę się unikać bhaktów, którzy inspirują mnie do obrażania dużych i małych wielbicieli Kryszny.
If learned devotees who chant and hear Hare Krishna maha-mantra are demons, then:
Who are the demons?
I avoid devotees who inspire me to offend great and small Krishna devotees.
Bhakta Waldemar aka Vasishta das once “initiated” by HKS a FISKCON “guru” via ritvik representative in person of Devamrita Swami (“Vegan swami”). Vasishta came to the point of changing a “little” the method of chanting in our sampradaya.
He does chant now Panca Tattva Maha mantra instead of Hare Krishna Maha Mantra. He uses Google translator and believes Tamal, Bhavananda, Jayapataka, & Company are innocent and could not have poisoned or tortured Srila Prabhupada.
He is in fact a very nice devotee, but impacted and destroyed by Devamrita became an extreme case of victim of FISKCON since about middle of the eighties. Now, the question is, what are we going to do about such practices, and we all know there are much more stories like this one?
Create just a FISKCON opposition party, a party based on speculations born out of righteous or moral to same extend emotions, or should rather stick to the sadhana practice and constant chanting of Hare Krishna, “sit down and cook down the milk”?
Who at all is your Ritvik Guru Krishnakant desai? What are his credentials? Why Yaśodanandan was waiting then years to reveal his notes done with the very special lead pencil? Why another ritvik apostle Gauridas Pandit das within this then years period was asking Tamal “the acharya” to initiate his wife?!
Why was he at all worshiping this cruel rascal while knowing his role in the alleged “anti ritvik plot”? Ask them the questions, I did ask some and the answers made me allert, showed clearly that they are not honest guys.
The same with another ritvik big fish, the Madhu Pandit, he never answered questions from me. We need all to unite and go out on the streets with the Hare Krishna Maha Mantra, we can’t worship cheaters and in the same way we can’t change the law of disciplic succession fully described in Srila Prabhupada authorised books, tapes, videos or letters. Let us do it!
ALL GLORIES TO HIS DIVINE GRACE A.C.BHAKTIVEDANTA SWAMI SRILA PRABHUPADA!–Bhakta Jarek Prabhu, don’t you know that not a blade of grass moves without SRI KRSNA’s sanction? So of course not a molecule moves in ISKCON without SRI KRSNA’s knowledge and assent. SRILA PRABHUPADA is THE ONLY GURU OF ISKCON — This is a fact because this is a direct order of SRILA PRABHUPADA. If you do not like it you may start your own KRSNA Conscious institution. Be my guest. Jump off this ISKCON boat that is going Back to GODHEAD. But if you do then you will perish–sorry. You are welcome to join us–honestly we want your help. You make your choice… JAI RADHE!
Devaki Nandana prabhu, thank You for the answer very much. However You do avoid or don’t get my point. My question was how Krishna may have planed (it’s according to you) the destruction of ISKCON, this is what You said: “… How ISKCON was derailed by demons is just part of SRI KRSNA’s plan, but SRILA PRABHUPADA’s desire can never be thwarted. …”
Of course I do accept your good intentions, I accept you are a devotee, but my comment while asking you the initial question makes your question to me invalid, since I said: “…To me it looks like complete nonsense. I could (and do) accept the inconceivable nature of Krishna knowing ahead what will happen to ISKCON, but have a real problem to grasp how He was planning it?”
So it could easily be saying that a no grass blade moves without Krishna’s will, isn’t? Saying that Krishna is sanctioning the free will choices of a jiva would be acceptable to me, but Krishna planning the derail of Srila Prabhupada’s ISKCON seems to me like a mayavada inlfuenced, or maybe just a result of some misunderstanding on your/or my part.
So I still do not know what you mean by your statements about Krishna’s plans in derailing ISKCON? Typical ritvik letargy? Another example, how to hell should I leave FISKCON when already since years all small kids in FISKCON Poland know that Jarek means devil?
Don’t you read at all you adversaries posts? No, I will never jump on your boat simply because you don’t have any. You imagine to have one, exactly the same way you imagine you getting diksha from the physically departed acarya, instead of taking shelter of the books Bhagavat which personifies Him and His instructions in toto.
In His comment to Srimad Bhagavatam 1.2.18 His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada writes:
So this is the remedy, both either one of the person Bhagavat is able to help us, not that we invent or rather in fact repeat the behaviour or pattern of the karthabaja sahajiyas heresy. I think if you are honest at all you should really consider to read Rocana prabhu’s Defeat of Ritvik Vada, it is a great and knowledgable book, by the way I have never found any sign of disrespect to any Vaishnava, neither ritvik or ISKCONite shown by the spoken devotee and really initiated disicple and follower of the Acarya. Please excuse my offences and try your best prabhus. My attempt will end here. Hare Krishna!
p.s. I do not have to create any new Hare Krishna Movement. I do follow those disciples of Srila Prabhupada who are not in FISKCON but do follow their great Spiritual Master and don’t speculate like you. Why by the way are you so easily calling me to become a heretic and an offender prabhu, only empowered acharyas have such direct deals with the Lord? The ISKCON (not FISKCON) Society is eternal as I understand and will last here on the Earth for at least 9.500 years to come
For time being you are unfortunately out!
ALL GLORIES TOP HIS DIVINE GRACE A.C.BHAKTIVEDANTA SWAMI SRILA PRABHUPADA! Wow, Bhakta Jarek Prabhu, you are a very formidable opponent. In a sense I must admit you are correct. When I said in my first post “that when ISKCON was derailed by demons that this was just KRSNA’s plan” I am not saying that SRI KRSNA HIMSELF destroyed ISKCON.
KRSNA says that “All living entities follow my path in all respects”– So, just like He controls the worms–he also controls the demon-guru-worms.
He sanctions their desires. When SRILA PRABHUPADA Himself came to America he had His typewriter stolen. Did SRI KRSNA “plan” this? Well, since SRI KRSNA knows past present and future, in a sense He did. Why KRSNA does what he does is beyond my limited understanding. And what do you mean by “Typical Ritvic lethargy”? Also, I never invited you onto my boat. I have none.
SRILA PRABHUPADA is the captain of this boat of which I speak. Please take advantage of the calm seas, strong breeze, and perfect captain of this boat and jump onboard with all your life and soul Prabhu–your future awaits. Your servant, Devaki Nandana dasa
Achandala-priya
He is dear even to the lowest outcastes.
On jest drogi nawet dla osób z poza najniższych kast.
Dear Devaki Nandana prabhu thank you and the Prabhupadanuga.eu editors for kindly letting our search for truth continue. I have asked you prabhu several questions, however it is nice you try to answer at least the initial one.
However though you try hard i still think you are not honest with us here. What struck me while reading your first comment to the article above it was a kind of triumphal quasi dramatical or pathetic manifesto thypical generally for women and no way less for sycophants or generally religious fanatics as well..
What I saw from it apart from the philosophical invalidity was the sense behind, kind of twisted glorification in a form of an immediate conclusion. Something like: “everything what had happened was just to culminate in the glorious and wonderful July 9 disclosure, and how the glorious ritvik change took place in how the Lord and His associates descend and how do They pick us up back home, back to Godhead. Therefore we ritviks are right and there is no other way, Krishna did offer Srila Prabhupada for the sake of saving us! Amen and alleluja brothers!”
You see prabhu now you are a little shacked by my incessancy, but however you try you make it only worsed. This is allways so, when one starts from a twisted or simply wrong assumption and being dishonest do fanatically continue despite all signs of defeat.
The whole so called ritivk movement is based on wrong assumption, and since your whole “philosophy” must and do shrink do the levels typical for other of that kind sentimentally driven cheating religions. You can’t in no way establish such to be truth that “How ISKCON was derailed by demons is just part of SRI KRSNA’s plan, but SRILA PRABHUPADA’s desire can never be thwarted.”
Since it is a mayavada concept exactly the same way your “Final Order” misty-twisty dramatisation is and will “henceforwad” ((for ever:)) be. By the way how is it that the desire of Srila Prabhupada for ISKCON not to be split is right and straight violeted by You ritviks and your twin brother counterpart FISCKON?
Are you still sleeping? How is it now, was it Krishna to go against His beloved Prabhupada wish and service work? Or maybe the free will and choice of the followers or perhaps perpetrators? What about “the great sinister movement”? Why did His Divine Grace Bhaktivednata Swami Srila Prabhupada said in 1970 in conjunction with the GBC revolt about the “great sinister movement” to be snaeked in instead of saying something like “Oh, so nice Lord Krishna sent to me those nice guys to derail my beloved ISKCON”?
Some more questions, what about all other questions I have written to you? I know, I am a demon, I do reject the “revelation of the July 9 revelation” (and I really do ), so I am noneworthy of talking to me, or I can’t understand the fine conlcusions of your thoughts. However, You should know that some of us know that you are destroying the movement in no way less than the shadow ISKCON does, prabhu.
y.s.bj
Dear Jarek prabhu, there is something like sense of decency. 41 fallen gurus and still people believe they know what is a genuine guru? No! When someone makes 41 times the same mistake he should admit he doesnt know.
http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/11-09/editorials5364.htm
Same at Gaudiya-matha. Narayana Swami left, Puri Maharaja left, and now it’s silent. No mentioning of successor…, on behalf of…, initiation ceremony….
When we do not know we should be at least – humble. That is to say, for the time being stop talking about guru-tattva. Period.
Instead: Prabhupada: “Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, at the time of his departure, requested all his disciples to form a governing body and conduct missionary activities cooperatively.” (Adi 12.8)
Cooperatively. Kali-yuga is marching forward and we do nothing? Sinister movement? Teach them to chant and take prasadam. Krishna will help. Krishna runs millions of universes with trillions of planets simultaneously.
Why He cannot remove some sinisters? Take it for granted, He can! Krishna appears when His devotees join together, sing and dance together.
Christianity had lots of problems with priests. They never had Lord Jesus fall down. Are we saying now that Christianity is superior?
So for the time being, join together and simply chant and take prasadam. Krishna will arrange when He sees His devotees work together.
“Now it is time for GBC members to be very very careful so that people may not point out any black spot in the behavior of our society.” (Letter to disciple, 1 September, 1971)
Mataji I try, but I can’t even seriously relate to your stage of mind. We called this kind of deficiency “space out”. Please let me not have to respond any more to your ignorant and completely unrelated comments. Such an impersonal approach! You pompatic, yet you absolutely and throughly ignore what your adversary have live for, did by precept, declared boldly for some years, spoken or written! You are talking with someone else while calling my name, are you insane or so? You simply waste my time.
ALL GLORIES TO HIS DIVINE GRACE A.C.BHAKTIVEDANTA SWAMI SRILA PRABHUPADA!–Bhakta Jarek Prabhu, I am sorry to say this but the more you write to/at this website–The more you actually sound crazy. I honestly do not want to make an offence to you, however your ramblings just do not make a lot of sense. Perhaps I am at fault.
One thing I will state: If SRILA PRABHUPADA ordered it or said it–THEN I ACCEPT IT AS MY ORDER. Rocana dasa can write all the non-sense he wants–everyone knows that he only hankers for a position of great power within ISKCON. Concerning all I previously wrote to you I think I made myself very clear. No need to plow the same ground.
Bhakta Jarek–Is SRILA PRABHUPADA your Guru? Or are you still looking to be cheated? Please just accept SRILA PRABHUPADA’s orders AS THEY ARE! Then you can very quickly make Spiritual progress and leave this world of misery forever.
If you will not surrender to SRILA PRABHUPADA and his direct instructions then go be cheated by the likes of Rocana dasa and/or all the other “gurus” who are tiny parasites who fight for SRILA PRABHUPADA’s servants to become worshipers of themselves.—-By the way, I have no understanding of why you insist on calling everyone on this forum “impersonal” or “mayavadi”.
It is you who will not turn your face directly towards THE PERSON of SRILA PRABHUPADA. Stop avoiding SRILA PRABHUPADA’s direct PERSONAL INSTRUCTIONS Prabhu.—I remain your servant, Devaki Nandana dasa JAI RADHE!
Dear Devaki Nandana Prabhu please accept my humble obeisances! Hare Krishna prabhu! Of course that Srila Prabhupada is my only Guru. I do accept Him and His teachings as the only pure representation of the Brahma Madhava Gaudiya Sampradaya! I accept also that Guru is one, I accept such as non different from Krishna Himself. So far however I don’t see any need to change the law of disciplic succession.
But how You come now to stay that Rocana is after looking for more position of power in ISKCON? This is what I call impersonalism, since you completely ignore your philosophical opponents manifesto (work, services, written or spoken declaration and actions), and no matter to you ritviks how much they are serious about, similarly you will say perhaps about Kailasa Candra prabhu, or about Rupanuga prabhu. This makes me call you impersonalists.
Mayavadis, because You completely neglect the whole body of the teachings of Srila Prabhupada the Sampraday Acharya. How? Well, you point with an extremely unbalanced focus to the July 9 letter which in fact was nothing more than a proof of another attempt of an sinister society act against Him, very dramatical in deed and in no less dramatical circumstances, but also a proof how easily this great Personality was solving all the obstacles in His Lila pastimes of saving His discples and followers from the clutches of maya.
Now you do rewrite the whole Guru Tattva, since You are biased and crazy about FISKCON (or Prabhupada himself?), and in fact You are changing His books no less than Jayaeditor Swami does (you do comment whether siksha or diksa as to fit your diverted meanings in terms of the ritvik “henceforward” misinterpretation).
Of course I do also see how much You are for Prabhupada somehow, yet your sentimental hate against FISKCON and it’s officials makes you blind to the truth. Sorry, but I consider You prabhus to be sahajiyas, similarly like the FISKCON. It is of course kind of generalisation, and with no power or intend to offend those amongst mentioned groups who are innocent yet very devoted and somehow special souls.
y.s. bj