“The twelve authorities – are they all pure devotees?”

“My dear boys, just see how much powerful is the chanting of the holy name of God is that this Ajamila, he did not directly mean to chant the holy name of Krsna, Narayana, but indirectly, because he chanted the name of Narayana, although this Narayana was not the original Narayana, his son, but it is so effective that he also became delivered.” Namoccarana- mahatmyam hareh pasyata putrakah, ajamilo ’pi yenaiva mrtyu- pasat: “He was saved from the imminent danger of death and being carried away by the Yamadutas.” I think we have covered. Na tatra pramanam vaktavyam: “How powerful is the holy name of Krsna, or God, there is no need of evidences. Just see practically how it is being done.” And Sridhara Svami says that na tatra pramanam vaktavyam drstah syad ity aha namoccaraneti yenaiva kevalena sakrd uccaritena. Once he uttered, simply, “Narayana…” That’s a fact. Once uttered, the holy name of God, without any offense, without any motive, immediately makes one free from this material world.

Devotee : Does one have to be a pure devotee to be a…? The twelve authorities, are they all pure devotees?

Prabhupada: Why do you ask this question? You have no sense. Without pure devotee, how they became authority? You are ask the question, “Is Mr. Rockefeller a rich man?” Your question is like that. He is known a very rich man, and he has foundation. If you ask, “Is he a rich man?” is that very intelligent question? Unless pure devotee, how they are authorized?

Devotee : What I was wondering about was the four Kumaras were… And I wanted to ask about Lord Kapila.

Prabhupada: Kapilo manuh.

Devotee : They weren’t pure devotees right from…, they weren’t devotees right from the first. The Nectar of Devotion says that the four Kumaras were first situated in the…

Prabhupada: Right from the… What do you mean by “right from the first”? What do you mean by that? Just like Rupa Gosvami. Rupa Gosvami was a minister of Muhammadan government. So what is his position? He was minister, he was working under government service, and he was rejected by the brahmana community. Then how he became gosvami?

Devotee : From the beginning of their…

Prabhupada: Beginning… Bhaktivinoda Thakura was a magistrate. What do you mean by “beginning”? As soon as he is situated in his own original position, then he is pure devotee. That’s all. It doesn’t matter what he has done in the past. It is called nagna-mati. Nagna- mati. One’s mother was naked in her childhood. So one is asking, “Mother, why you are putting on those saris? You were naked. You can remain naked.” This kind of argument is no argument. Whatever one may be in his past, that’s all right. As soon as he is situated in pure devotee, devotional state, that’s all. One hasn’t got to inquire, “from the beginning” or “from the end.” There is no need of such inquiry. As soon as he is situated in his original position, hitva anyatha-rupam svarupena vyavasthitih, gives up nondevotional activities, but is situated in devotional service, immediately he is all right, pure devotee. Doesn’t matter whether he was in the beginning. Because even a person, ordinary person, ordinarily, he is not contaminated. He lives aloof from this material existence. But for some times, even if he is influenced, that doesn’t matter. As soon as he comes to his real position, he is a pure devotee. There is no question of tracing his past history. There is no question. You be situated in pure devotional service; you are pure devotee. That’s all. There is no question of inquiring what he was in the past. That doesn’t matter. Is it clear? Yes. Just like Ajamila. In the past history he, simply sinful, Jagai-Madhai, simply sinful, but as soon as they come to the position of pure devotional life, he is pure.