https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pq3O5ZygeGU
I drink cow urine every day, so I don’t have COVID-19, says BJP MP Pragya Thakur
BJP MP Pragya Thakur, who’s known for her controversial remarks, has stirred a controversy yet again with her comments on COVID-19. At a recent gathering of party members, Thakur can be heard claiming that the reason she has yet not been infected by the novel coronavirus is because she drinks gaumutra (cow urine) everyday. Cow urine can cure lung infection caused by Covid.
In a video, which is being heavily circulated on social media, Thakur can be heard saying: “If we have desi gau mutra (urine from an indigenous cow) every day, then it cures lung infection from Covid. I am in deep pain but I take cow urine every day. So now, I don’t have to take any medicine against corona and I don’t have corona,” Pragya Thakur is heard telling a party gathering.
DRINKING COWS MILK IS SO VALUABLE AND BENEFICIAL
Prabhupada: Milk is miracle food. If you drink more milk
and milk products, then your brain will be very sharp. You will
understand things very nicely, corectly. Therefore milk is very important.
Aug 14 1976
Prabhupāda: No, health, brain, everything. Milk is miracle food. And we are practically experiencing in our farms that if the cows are protected nicely, they can supply immense milk. We are getting in our farms, extra milk. Everyone is eating so many preparations, sandeśa, rasagullā, rābrī. They are surprised. In their history they have not eaten all these things.
Dr. Patel: They are eating the milk-producing animal so milk will not…
Prabhupāda: No, they advertise milk is bad.
Dr. Patel: Who?
Prabhupāda: These Europeans, Americans.
Dr. Patel: Really?
Prabhupāda: Yes. “Don’t eat milk.” Do they not? And they cannot drink also. In Bengal there is a proverb, kule pete ghiya(?) (indistinct). If you supply preparation made of ghee to the dog, he cannot digest it.
Note—because many of these “vegans” cant drink milk, they find ways to say it is bad for you but it is due to their past sinful lives that in this life, they cannot take advantage of the miracle food called milk.
Guest: (quotes proverb in Bengali)
Prabhupāda: Ha! They cannot digest factually. They get, what is called? That disease?
Harikeśa: Jaundice.
Prabhupāda: Jaundice. They cannot eat much milk product.
Dr. Patel: Yes, sir. Cow is the biggest factory to produce protein, first-class proteins for human beings. Instead of taking advantage of the products of the factory, they eat out the factory itself.
Prabhupāda: So we see practically in our farm the cows give more milk than other farms.
Oct 10 1973 bombay
This is the position of Kali-yuga. Mandāḥ sumanda-matayo manda-bhāgyā hy upadrutāḥ [SB 1.1.10]. Therefore they are so unfortunate, always disturbed, always disturbed. Mandāḥ sumanda-matayaḥ. Prāyeṇālpāyuṣaḥ kalāv asmin yuge janāḥ. First qualification is they do not live long. A very short period of life. And still manda, very bad. Manda-matayaḥ. And they have got their philosophy, something rascaldom. Mandāḥ sumanda-matayo manda-bhāgyāḥ, and all unfortunate. They cannot eat even properly. There is no milk, there is no ghee, there is no rice. This is the position of Kali-yuga.
TRANSLATION : “In My last birth I was born in the family of cowherd men, and I gave protection to the calves and cows. Because of such pious activities, I have now become the son of a brāhmaṇa.”
PURPORT : The words of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu, the greatest authority, herein clearly indicate that one becomes pious simply by keeping cows and protecting them. Unfortunately, people have become such rascals that they do not even care about the words of an authority. People generally consider cowherd men lowly members of society, but herein Caitanya Mahāprabhu confirms that they are so pious that in their next lives they are going to be brāhmaṇas. The caste system has a specific purpose. If this scientific system is followed, human society will get the greatest benefit. Heeding this instruction by the Lord, people should serve cows and calves and in return get ample quantities of milk. There is no loss in serving the cows and calves, but modern human society has become so degraded that instead of giving protection to the cows and serving them, people are killing them. How can they expect peace and prosperity in human society while committing such sinful activities? It is impossible
Dec 11 1968 LA
Just like milk, as soon as in touch with something sour, it becomes yogurt. The yogurt is nothing but milk, but in connection with some sour material, it is yogurt. So yogurt is milk, but it is not milk also. Your child requires milk. You cannot give yogurt. Nobody can argue, “Oh, yogurt is milk preparation, why not give?” No. It will be not beneficial for him. Similarly, if you want release from this material world, you have to take to Viṣṇu, no other demigod. If you want strength, then you have to drink milk, not yogurt. Yogurt, at times you can eat for some taste or some particular purpose. The milk is general drinking. Just take the statistics, how many bottles of milk are sold in the store and how many bottles of yogurt is sold. The yogurt and milk is the same thing. Why they’ll demand milk and not the yogurt? Is that right? Yes. But nobody can put argument, “Oh, why do you take milk? Take the yogurt.” No. Yes?
Jan 15 1974 Hawaii
And here also, we see that the Dharmarāja is inquiring about the comforts of the cow. Amba, kaccid bhadre, what is, anāmayam ātmanas te. Āmayam means disease. So “Whether you are quite comfortable by your health?” This is very essential to keep cows very comfortably. If they feel comfortable, then you get the most nourishing food, milk. We are practically seeing in our New Vrindaban center, because the cow are feeling secure in our custody, they’re delivering milk up to the eighty pounds daily. You’ll be surprised. So if you get milk products, milk, then you can prepare so many preparations full of vitamins, which will nourish your brain. Dull brain cannot understand what is spiritual knowledge. Therefore, that Mr. Bernard Shaw, he wrote a book. Perhaps you know it. You Are What You Eat. If you keep your brain dull, then how you can understand? Because without becoming very intelligent man, one cannot understand Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is stated in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta, kṛṣṇa yei bhaje sei baḍa catura: “One who takes to Kṛṣṇa consciousness seriously and perfectly, he must be very, very intelligent.” Dull brain cannot accept it. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate [Bg. 7.19]. So we have to make our brain very clean. And for that purpose you require to drink not very much, at least, one pound or half-pound milk daily. That is essential. But no meat-eating. This is intelligence.
Johannesburg oct 20 1975
There must be sufficient milk in the human society. If you drink more milk and milk products, then your brain will be very sharp. You will understand things very nicely, corectly. Therefore milk is very important. In the Vedic śāstra cow protection is recommended. Why? Because milk is very, very important thing. Milk is… What about the meat-eaters? If there are meat-eaters, they can eat other animals, but especially they should not eat the cow. They should give them protection. So because the vaiśyas, the first class, second class, third class, they are meant for producing food for the society… So milk is very important. Therefore it is recommended, kṛṣi-gorakṣya-vāṇijyam. And if there is excess, they can trade.
SB 4.26.13 purport…
This verse is very significant for those desiring to elevate themselves to a higher level of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. When a person is initiated by a spiritual master, he changes his habits and does not eat undesirable eatables or engage in the eating of meat, the drinking of liquor, illicit sex or gambling. Sāttvika-āhāra, foodstuffs in the mode of goodness, are described in the śāstras as wheat, rice, vegetables, fruits, milk, sugar, and milk products. Simple food like rice, dhal, capātīs, vegetables, milk and sugar constitute a balanced diet, but sometimes it is found that an initiated person, in the name of prasāda, eats very luxurious foodstuffs.
Antya 1.92 purport…
Such leaders have no chance to purify their eating. Politicians meet together and exchange good wishes by drinking liquor, which is so polluted and sinful that naturally drunkards and meat-eaters develop a degraded mentality in the mode of ignorance. The processes of eating in different modes are explained in the Bhagavad-gītā, wherein it is stated that those who eat rice, wheat, vegetables, milk products, fruit and sugar are situated in the elevated quality of goodness. Therefore if we want a happy and tranquil political situation, we must select leaders who eat Kṛṣṇa prasāda. Otherwise the leaders will eat meat and drink wine, and thus they will be asaṁskṛtāḥ, unreformed, and kriyā-hīnāḥ, devoid of spiritual behavior. In other words, they will be mlecchas and yavanas, or men who are unclean in their habits. Through taxation, such men exploit the citizens as much as possible, and in this way they devour the citizens of the state instead of benefiting them. We therefore cannot expect a government to be efficient if it is headed by such unclean mlecchas and yavanas.
SB 1.8.35 purport…
Here it is said that avidyā-kāma-karmabhiḥ. By ignorance, they are thinking by opening factories they will be happy. That is avidyā. He does not know that this is ignorance. Why you should open factory? That is… This is called ugra-karma. There is no need of opening factory. You have got land. Here are so many lands. You produce your food grains. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni [Bg. 3.14]. You eat sumptuously food grain, milk, and that will be available without any factory. The factory cannot produce milk or food grain. The present scarcity of foodstuff means everybody is engaged in the city, producing bolts and nuts. Who is producing food grain? This is the solution of economic problem. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni. Therefore we are trying to engage our men to produce their own food. Be self-sufficient so that these rascals may see that how one can live very peacefully, eating the food grains and milk, and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. This is our mission.
July 24 1973 london
In India in village, there is, still the system is amongst the poor men, the cultivators, that if the cultivator cannot provide to keep a cow, he will not marry. Jaru and garu. Jaru means wife, and garu means cow. So one should keep a wife if he is able to keep a cow also. Jaru and garu. Because if you keep a wife, immediately there will be children. But if you cannot give them cows’ milk, the children will be rickety, not very healthy. They must drink sufficient milk. So cow is therefore considered mother. Because one mother has given birth to the child, the another mother is supplying milk. So everyone should be obliged to mother cow, because she is supplying milk. So according to our śāstra there are seven mothers. Ādau mātā, real mother, from whose body I have taken my birth. Ādau mātā, she is mother. Guru-patnī, the wife of teacher. She is also mother. Ādau mātā guru-patnī, brāhmaṇī. The wife of a brāhmaṇa, she is also mother.
June 10 1976 LA
Prabhupāda: (laughter) Huh? That he can send to us. Milk is so nice that it cannot be wasted, even a drop. First of all you get milk, that is the Indian system. So there is a big milk pan, and as soon as the milk is drawn it is put into the pan. The pan is in the fire. So as much as you like, drink milk, children, elderly persons. Then at night, when there is no demand for milk, it is converted into yogurt, not wasted. Whatever balance milk is there is converted into yogurt. Then in daytime also you take yogurt, as much as you like. If it is not all consumed, then it is stored in a pot. Then when that pot is enough stored, then you churn it. Churn it, and you get butter and Buttermilk. So again you take buttermilk with cāpāṭi and everything, not a single drop is lost. Then the butter, you melt it, convert into ghee and store it, it will stay for years. So not a drop of milk can be wasted. And this butter, because in the village they are eating so much milk products, they do not require butter or ghee. Maybe little, so that is stored. They go to the city. The city men they require, especially. Ghee is very important thing in the city. So they purchase. So in exchange of that money, whatever they want, they purchase in the city and come back. But the simply maintaining the cows, their economic problem is solved. Simply maintaining the cows. And to maintain cow there is no difficulty. The boys…. Just like Kṛṣṇa, as boy, was taking the cows, the calves, in the fields. They are grazing here and there, and coming back they’re giving milk. Only one attendant required to take them into the pasturing ground and bring them back home. You don’t require to give them food even. Simply take care, they give milk, and with milk you make so many preparations. Yes?
Some Conclusions—This last statement by Srila Prabhupada shows how very much important is the cow and drinking her milk and the excess in the form of ghee or butter can be sold to get money for things you cannot produce. As he says-economic problem solved.
Its solved, that is, if we can live a simple life like the villagers he is talking about. Our problem is we are not very simple in our lifestyle today so we have to work for so many years just to keep body and soul together. But this method of living off the land and depending upon mother cow is simple foreign to most of us . And its inconceivable as to how this can be done because we are so accustomed to depending upon machines, electricity, gas, oil, cell phones, etc to survive, but yet survival has been done for centuries by millions without all these contraptions we call-”necessary”. What we call “necessary” is called as maya by Srila Prabhupada for here is what he says about so called necessary.
July 14 1975 Philadelphia
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually the trees are absolutely necessary for the survival of animals.
Prabhupāda: That is another thing. We say nothing is necessary, simply Kṛṣṇa is necessary. That is material conception: “This is necessary. This is necessary.” But Kṛṣṇa says, “Nothing is necessary.” Sarva-dharmān parityajya [Bg. 18.66]. You are simply planning and becoming entangled with so-called “necessary.”
Svarūpa Dāmodara: But that is on the spiritual platform.
Prabhupāda: You can create spiritual platform immediately. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān [Bg. 14.26]. If you fully engage yourself in devotional service, immediately you are above this material conception.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: So the concept that the three modes of material nature, they’re working all species, so it’s not the…
Prabhupāda: They are directing. Just like in the jail there are different departmental management, similarly, this management is required because you are in the jail. If you don’t go to jail, the management may be closed. But you are thinking, “If I do not go to jail, how it will exist?” That is your business, say that “If we all become liberated, how this world will go on?” They say like that, as if it is very necessary.
So we are thinking so many things as “necessary” when in fact this is just another form of illusion we are under. Chanting Hare Krsna mantra is meant to erase and eliminate these illusions from our consciousness. The more we pursue materialism the harder it is to accept the principles of spiritual life.
• 760731r2.par Conversations … little cottages, grow little vegetable, little barley or wheat and milk. That is sufficient. We don’t require much. We don’t want luxury. We want just to subsist. Yavad artha prayojana. We hate the idea of luxury, unnecessary.
• 760802rc.par Conversations … of how to utilize the whole land. The situation is very good, good prospect. I want that self-independent here, as far as possible. But you have got enough materials. With woods you can make cottages. Then land becomes clear, then utilize it.
Therefore those people who are against cow protection and milk drinking or cannot drink milk are unfortunate because it is one of the main ways to please the Supreme Lord and nourish our brains.
Hare Krsna
Damaghosa das
We Drink Cow Urine
Indian cow dung festival celebrates end to Diwali
Pamho agtacbsp, apara ekadasi ki jay,thank you to post this nice article on the cow products benefit, I also drink cow urine and it’s easy to find it in the uk,yes the cow is a miracle it’s like spiritual gold and a uncivilised society have to suffer life after life for cow murder,the yamaduta knows it very well since they are in charge to punish such abominable living creatures as cow murder,it’s a cursed society through vikarma by keeping the dog at home and the cow to slaughter house,they heart has become more polluted by dog urine,anyway just keeping going Sri Gsuranga mahaprabhu will make justice we just tolerate all these ugram karma by walking away from ugram karma agtacbsp ys haribol
It is learned from the revealed scriptures that the moon was born from the milk ocean. There is a milk ocean in the upper planets, and there Lord Viṣṇu, who controls the heart of every living being as Paramātmā (the Supersoul), resides as the Kṣīrodakaśāyī Viṣṇu. Those who do not believe in the existence of the ocean of milk because they have experience only of the salty water in the ocean should know that the world is also called the go, which means the cow. The urine of a cow is salty, and according to Āyur-vedic medicine the cow’s urine is very effective in treating patients suffering from liver trouble. Such patients may not have any experience of the cow’s milk because milk is never given to liver patients. But the liver patient may know that the cow has milk also, although he has never tasted it. Similarly, men who have experience only of this tiny planet where the saltwater ocean exists may take information from the revealed scriptures that there is also an ocean of milk, although we have never seen it.
Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/sb/3/2/8
So, it means simply that the Cow Urine is used ONLY for the medicinal purpose ONLY to treat the ailment of the BODY.
One must not make a practise of drinking Cow Urine daily. That is NOT required.
We all must drink the MILK of Go Mata after serving her needs. That’s how I was brought up by my family.
Thanks Mahesh Prabhu, quoting from the Sastras.
Hare Krishna. All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.
Indian humped cows are mostly all A2 but most of the milk in the West is A1 which is a mutation created due to breeding cows for quantity (not quality), such as Fresians (black and white) and Holstein cows (brown).
A1 milk is harder to digest due to mutated A1 protein. This milk also has a ‘slimy’ aftertaste. A2 milk is readily available in Australia, is easy to digest and has a ‘creamy’ aftertaste, though it costs twice as much as the A1 it is much preferred for the health.
Cow urine destroys the ‘shell’ or outer covering of the ‘corona’ (cold and flu) viruses and even a teaspoon of fresh urine from Go Mata can accomplish this. Cow protection is not just about drinking the cows’ milk, but all of the valuable aspects of Vedic culture are embodied within Go Mata.
In India it is very difficult to obtain cow milk which is not adulterated with buffalo, or even worse ‘cut’ with dangerous chemicals, urea and soap powder! A2 milk is becoming more popular in Australia and it is even listed on the stock exchange. Guernsey cows have the highest A2 factor followed by the Jersey cows here in Australia so these cows are becoming more sought after as the sales of A2 milk increases here.
Best thing is to have our own cow, but that is not possible when living in the suburbs or not being part of a large family or community, though this suburban living is becoming increasingly troublesome.
Yes Suds prabhu, even if you can get fresh milk straight from the cow or farm, if it is not the A2 variety then still not the best.
My wife & I have been drinking A2 milk since it first came on the market in Australia many years ago and it is beautiful to taste, of course after first offering to Sri Sri Guru Gauranga. There are many instances where people have not been able to assimilate milk (lactose intolerant..bad karma), but have had no problems with the A2 variety.
Considering the hellish situation for Go Mata today, it is so important to offer their milk to Their Lordships, which will spiritual benefit all the cows contributing this most valuable food.
paraṁ vijayate śrī-kṛṣṇa-saṅkīrtanam
Dear Balarama prabhu,
How is it “bad karma” to be intolerant to pasteurised, homogenised A1 protein milk which is as Sudarsana says “a mutation due to breeding cows for quantity not quality”?
I always had severe allergies to this dead unhealthy product and once asked Bhavananda in a class he gave why many people have allergies to milk if it is such a wonder food.
His arrogant and short reply was “bad karma” and he moved on.
I felt extremely disappointed with his answer and quickly discounted this person as being a so called “guru”
Since I drink A2 milk and particularly biodynamic un-homogenised milk from Mungali creek here in Cairns I have no problems.
I’m surprised you choose the same answer as Bhavananda, then you go on to say that people who cannot assimilate A1 milk have no problem with A2 milk.
It’s not a case of “bad karma” it’s a case of people’s bodies rejecting an unnatural food product.
Dear Sundarananda das,
Great to hear that your health has improved.
I never heard Bhavananda say that in a class, but do not dispute it, so what are you insinuating…..
I was not quoting him, rather the writer of this article, Damaghosa das where he presents “due to their past sinful lives”… (I think that means ‘karma’).
“Note—because many of these “vegans” cant drink milk, they find ways to say it is bad for you but it is due to their past sinful lives that in this life, they cannot take advantage of the miracle food called milk.
Guest: (quotes proverb in Bengali)
Prabhupāda: Ha! They cannot digest factually. They get, what is called? That disease?
Harikeśa: Jaundice.
Prabhupāda: Jaundice. They cannot eat much milk product.”
Also this question about ‘adulterated’ milk was raised many times with Srila Prabhupada, including the terrible treatment of cows, but he said regardless of the problem, we still must take it if the pure milk product is not available. During Srila Prabhupada’s visits, we had never heard of A1 or A2 (until recent decade or so) and he always accepted the commercial milk that was offered with no problems.
हरे कृष्ण
Dear Balarama das,
Thanks for your reply.
You ask “what am I insinuating?”
Back in the zonal guru days, many standard answers were given to explain complex questions from inquisitive aspirants. One would be considered offensive and a trouble maker for daring to question the status quo.
You were around in the zonal guru era fully supporting these bogus gurus and Bhavananda in particular.
How you wrote “bad karma” reminded me of a typical rote answer given by authoritarian leaders like yourself.
Another good one was calling the sales of Hong Kong paintings “Sankirtan”
The milk topic is a complex one. Most aspiring devotees come from sinful backgrounds including Bhavananda.
As you said in your previous reply, many people allergic to A1 milk have no problem drinking A2 milk. So what happened to their “bad karma?”
Dear Sundarananda das,
I don’t know you or about anything regarding your initiation history, but it seems from your comments that you are regrettably carrying quite a heavy load from the past 35 years or so. If you did happen to take ‘initiation’ from Bhavananda das, you should also know that at the time of the Zonals in the 80’s, there was simply no alternative.
Knowledge of Srila Prabhupada’s ‘Ritvik- Final Order’ was concealed or withheld by the GBC from the devotees, including myself and all other TPs that I knew, both in Australia and internationally. As my recently departed dear friend and Godbrother, Mahasrnga prabhu said to me a few years ago, ‘Bal, we were really hoodwinked by the GBC in those days’. Nothing to be proud of!
I personally resigned in 1989 as Melbourne TP after seeing the system for what it was, and it wasn’t until 1995 when I received an original copy of Krsnakant Desai’s “The Final Order”, sent to me from the UK, that I became aware of the main cause for the now systemic problems.
Hindsight might seem a very wonderful and satisfying thing, but it can also be a great deterrent towards real progress. I can only suggest you consider the special words of Srila Bhaktivinode Thakur…
“Forget the past that sleeps and ne’er
The future dream at all,
But act in times that are with thee
And progress thee shall call.”
I’m finished my discussion here, however if you would like, you may request the webmaster at the forum for my email address.
Nice to hear from you and best wishes for your good health & Krsna consciousness.
हरे कृष्ण
Dear Balarama das,
Thanks for your well considered reply and kind words.
Thanks too for all your service and sacrifice. I know you undertook heavy responsibilities and tried your best to serve Srila Prabhupada.
Wishing all the best. 🙏🙏
Dear Sundarananda das, thanks for your reply prabhu.
My very close friend here on the Gold Coast, Mandapa prabhu, informed me of the abuse you received while in Brisbane from Tirtha-rat, the GBC stooly who was laundering illegal drug money through ISKCON accounts. I’m not sure if you’re aware of the history, but in this case in spite of dredging the past, truth be known!
In approximately 2001, Tirtharaja das was appointed GBC treasurer in charge of the International GBC account. He then moved the account from a European bank to the Westpac Bank in Indoorapilly, a suburb in Brisbane.
He, along with his associate Krsna Kirtan das became involved with drug runners, Matthew Terrero, Con Catsakis and Steve Jomma. Tirtharaja (aka Anthony Sticha) then arranged for Matthew Terrero to have use of the ISKCON account to electronically launder the proceeds of illegal cocaine drug transactions to offshore accounts in various countries as diverse as Mexico, China, Middle East and Europe. Of course several GBC (Great Big Crooks) profited handsomely from Tirtharat’s generosity
This money had been periodically deposited in cash to the ISKCON GBC account at the Westpac bank branch in King Street, SYDNEY. These deposits of drug money totaled up to 16 Million dollars for a period of just over a year.
The money was in uniform bills, damp and cold, indicating it had been in storage for a period of time. The bank being suspicious, informed Police who began surveillance of the operation. Further it was determined that the money was proceeds from a large cocaine shipment which had entered Australia by boat and was being distributed throughout New South Wales.
In 2002 they moved in and arrested Jomma while he was in the process of depositing $557,000 in cash. Jomma consequently denied any knowledge of the source and said he was depositing it on behalf of ISKCON. He produced a letter of authority written on a BRISBANE TEMPLE LETTERHEAD, indicating that he would be the authorized person to make deposits on behalf of ISKCON.
It was signed by Anthony Sticha (Tirtharaja das). Meanwhile Terrero had opened another account in the name of ISKCON and proceeded to deposit a further $200.000 which the police also seized.
The New South Wales Crime Commission advised they were not going to pursue ISKCON or Sticha further, because at the time of the offenses the law was such that the onus of proof for the illegality of unspecified financial transactions favored the criminal.
However under changes to the legislation recently brought in, they would certainly have laid charges against all concerned, including Anthony Sticha. These charges now incur penalties up to 25 years in jail.
In ‘hindsight’, definitely a blessing that you got far away from that character, who basically destroyed the Brisbane yatra financially & spiritually.
Kind regards
हरे कृष्ण
Dear Balarama prabhu,
Thanks for your informative expose on Tirtha. I hadn’t heard the details. I’m incredulous that he could be so foolish. I guess he thought he was hunting for the “white rhinoceros”
Thanks again for taking the time and trouble to share that info and thanks to Mandarpa prabhu for his kind and caring association. He is a lovely soul.
All glories to Srila Prabhupada !! 🙏
I was one of those that sold Hong Kong paintings and car bumper stickers, football hats,and books! we did what ever we could to raise money to pay temple bills do you now say it was wrong. Perhaps you do not understand We are still here, still chanting rounds, disciples of Srila Prabhupada’s disciples, Myself from Bhavananda Prabhu. despite problems and venomous animosity from some that should have been supportive. api cet su-durācāro, bhajate mām ananya-bhāk sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ samyag vyavasito hi saḥ.
We learnt very early on that maya will target the individual, we have seen it happen.
I take exception to you pointing the finger of scorn, it is not Vaisnava behaviour. Hare Krishna
Mr Phillip Davies/Pradyumna das: Perhaps you do not understand We are still here, still chanting rounds, disciples of Srila Prabhupada’s disciples, Myself from Bhavananda Prabhu. despite problems and venomous animosity from some that should have been supportive. api cet su-durācāro, bhajate mām ananya-bhāk sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ samyag vyavasito hi saḥ.
Mahesh: You just have no clear understanding of the philosophy – at all.
Bhavananda is a CONDITIONED soul. THEREFORE he can NOT initiated you. The Initiation process recognised by Srila Prabhupada is Ritvik Initiation as per his July 9th 1977 ORDER.
Read the following:
ONLY MAHA-BHAGAVATA IS DIKSA GURU: Srila Prabhupada is OUR Diksa Guru For As Long as His Books Are On The Planet
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=41422
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Srila Prabhupada’s Disciple
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=43453
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Srila Prabhupada’s Letters on Ritvik Initiation
http://www.iskcontruth.com/p/srila-prabhupadas-letters-on-ritvik_13.html
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
By the way, the verse:
api cet su-durācāro, bhajate mām ananya-bhāk sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ samyag vyavasito hi saḥ.
refers to ACCIDENTAL falldown:
Similarly, the accidental falldown of a devotee from the path of a saintly character does not make him abominable.
Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/bg/9/30
The falldowns of Bhavananda and the rest of bogus pretender gurus are NOT accidental. Read the colorful history:
http://www.harekrsna.org/guru-photos.htm
That “venomous animosity” as you call it may be a result of persons who took severe offense with regards to the severe beatings Bhavananda use to inflict on young children in the Mayapur gurukula or the fact that he molestered a child at New Gaudadesh Farm in Australia, who later committed suicide or even worse that Bhavananda (over a sustained period of 9 months and until his departure!) gave poison to Srila Prabhupada (see poison whispers!). The fact that you are still chanting your rounds is due to Srila Prabhupada’s mercy and in spite of the illegal, subversive, traitorous, disgusting and vile activities of Bhavanandasura.
Plotting and sustained poisoning of Srila Prabhupada over a period of at least 9 months is not “accidental falldown” this is the activity of a demon who is destined for hell!
Well said Sudarsana prabhu. My sentiments exactly. 🙏🙏
It’s Laudable that you sacrificed your life to collect income to support the temple.
Calling the sales of paraphernalia “Sankirtana” is the misunderstanding.
We are not mayavadis.
Business is generally undertaken by householders. Selling paraphernalia is business, not “Sankirtana”
Book distribution, Chanting on the streets or together in the temple is “Sankirtana”
All glories to your sacrifice and devotion.
As I mentioned to Balaram Prabhu (in an e mail) “We are all responsible for putting our faith in fallible personalities, so we have to see that it is our own fault to a large extent as we also have to deal with our own ignorance” To continue to worship demons by quoting ‘api cet sudaracaro’ as someone has suggested is of course the ‘height of foolishness and stupidity!’ or to think that such a demonic individual had a ‘positive’ influence on their present consciousness is complete delusion.
Non of us knew anything when we joined up but all of us made mistakes. Of course the sincere devotee always regrets these mistakes of the past and is always in a process of self analysis and re-evaluation of events, activities and circumstances we continually find ourselves in. We are thus (if we are sincere) always a ‘work in progress’ so to constantly remain under the guidance of His Divine Grace AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada’s instructions.
I agree it was silly to call paraphernalia sales ”sankirtana” when it is actually ‘madhukari’. This activity (selling paraphernalia) was going on when Srila Prabhupada was still present in his vapu form by Guru Kripa Prabhu and others and was considered invaluable by Srila Prabhupada as it freed him up to concentrate on the translation of his books.
Dear Sudarsana prabhu,
My understanding of Madhukari is as follows:
Madhukari is an Indian tradition which encourages a monk to live life like a Honey bee does.
The monk is encouraged to beg for his own food by visiting different families door to door. The monk must beg for his food and be dependent on the generosity of the householder. At the same time, the monk must not suck the entire nectar, he must not demand too much from any house. He should fulfil his need for food by taking as little alms as possible and by begging from one door to another.
Travelling the world selling Hong Kong paintings while dressed in a suit with wig on, lying and cheating people about the authenticity of the art work is very clearly business not Madhukari.
Srila Prabhupada said that business means cheating.
So let’s just call it as it is. Vaisya activity or business is 100 percent legitimate and needed. All glories to the great souls who undertake this service for the Iskcon mission and their own householder needs.
Many devotees, including myself, refused to participate in this business activity. On the other hand, I was happy to go out on the street selling Srila Prabhupadas books.
I joined Iskcon in Europe and was trained to sell books on the streets of England, not an easy gig. However, it was humbling and after some time, I and others met with good results, both in books being sold and Laxmi being collected.
Hope you are well prabhu, thanks for your always stimulating comments.
🙏🙏
Dear Sundarananda Prabhu,
What you say regarding Madhukari is true, though in many countries begging for food or money is considered illegal so some adjustment needs to be made (particularly, as we would not accept food from non devotees). One can still (like the bumblebee) go from person to person to collect Laxmi as this benefits the giver also. This also gives respect to the seller also as people see that this person is engaged in an occupation and not begging or pan-handleing like a bum.
As per Srila Prabhupada’s direction half of the money collected went to buy books, most of which around 95% were given away free. I tried selling books directly (door to door) but the most I ever made in a day was far less than what I could collect selling paraphernalia, even though I was a ‘mediocre picker’ as some devotees could collect ‘astronomical amounts’ with paraphernalia.
Selling books directly, however is always preferred, so you were right to refuse to engage in selling paraphernalia although I take exception to your claim of lying and cheating about the “origins” of the paintings, as most people never asked about this and I only had to refund one dissatisfied person in the 16 years I was doing it!
Sure, it is Business but also Madhukari or collecting Alms with some adjustment for ‘time, place and circumstance’ but everything I collected went straight to the temple and the same for most of those I travelled with (with some exception for grihasta’s in some cases).
So for some who collected huge amounts (with paraphernalia) this was the most practical choice, but a choice that needs to be made by the individual.
Always good to hear your thoughts!
Daso Smi
Let me know where to get some fresh daily organic free range cow urine here in Toronto Canada.
DUH!
So many experts chirping up about things they know little about!
Fascinating how devotees consider themselves immunologists, viriologists and epidemiologists just by dint of spending time on the internet without ever passing an exam.
Being expert in transcendentalism does not necessarily convey to other fields. Some gurus had absolutely no understanding of science. For example, outer space geometry and calculations. At least Śrīla Prabhupāda was humble enough to admit he didn’t have a clue in that department. Obviously modern devotees exhibit hubris and are not of the same ilk.
The 5th Canto is a mess of typos which I have covered before. Bhaktisiddhānta was an expert in Vedic astronomy/astrology and used values from the Sūrya-Siddhānta and Siddhānta-Śiromaṇi. As His disciple Prabhupāda accepted His guru’s instruction without question but admitted He did not fully understand it.
I would never lay claim that I understood it better but I would hazard a guess that my comprehension is at least better than the average bear. The 5th Canto and Siddhānta-Śiromaṇi / Sūrya-Siddhānta do not reconcile. As a competent asrologer ican attest that the Siddhantas concur with astronomy. The 5th is something else, possibly reflecting the viewpoint from the Heavenly planets of the demigods.
Samsbanned says ;
“I would never lay claim that I understood it better but I would hazard a guess that my comprehension is at least better than the average bear. The 5th Canto and Siddhānta-Śiromaṇi / Sūrya-Siddhānta do not reconcile. As a competent asrologer ican attest that the Siddhantas concur with astronomy. The 5th is something else, possibly reflecting the viewpoint from the Heavenly planets of the demigods. ”
The QUESTION arises that you are NOT explaining The 5th Canto and Siddhānta-Śiromaṇi / Sūrya-Siddhānta why and where it does not reconcile ?
Are you referring to yourself as a competent astrologer or just making a statement ?
Of course, ” The 5th is something else, possibly reflecting the viewpoint from the Heavenly planets of the demigods. ”
That is why we the conditioned JIVAS have to rise to the Platform of Devas in order to understand the 5th Canto. Otherwise, you can not make such NON-SENSE comments with your whimsical mind which are of no value.
OM TAT SAT.
Hare Krishna. All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.
PAMHO, AGTSP. Hare Kṛṣṇa Prabhu,
As far as ‘competent astrologer’ goes, I don’t need software or a computer to draw a chart. I am old school and learnt to do it using pen and paper, a table of houses, ephemeris, etc. I know my way around the logistics of spatial dimensions, geometry and basic trigonometry and understand the difference between both the sidereal zodiac and the tropical zodiac used in eastern and western jyotish/astronomy/astrology.
As far as the difference between Vedic Cosmology as explained in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam and the astronomical models used in both Sūrya-Siddhānta, Siddhānta-Śiromaṇi and western astrology journals, anyone familiar with them is conversant with how they do not reconcile. This needs no explanation as it is obvious to those acquainted. If you need an answer may I suggest you study them and discover the truth yourself.
I have covered this many times before but I will give a succinct response nevertheless. Apart from the difference in geocentric and heliocentric models (which make absolutely no difference to astronomical calculations whatsoever) the main difference between the Bhagavatam and Jyotish or astrology is that the 5th Canto cannot be used to calculate Ekadasi. Or any other holy day etc as there are no formulae given for calculating tithi etc.
I hope that makes sense to you.
Hare Kṛṣṇa
Ys Sam
हरे कृष्ण
The following is taken from the Purport of HDG. Srila Prabhupada, BG.18.71
” ……. Therefore simply by hearing Bhagavad-gītā, even a person who does not try to be a pure devotee attains the result of righteous activities. Thus a pure devotee of the Lord gives everyone a chance to become free from all sinful reactions and to become a devotee of the Lord.
Generally those who are free from sinful reaction are righteous. Such persons very easily take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. The word puṇya-karmaṇām is very significant here. This refers to the performance of great sacrifice. Those who are righteous in performing devotional service but who are not pure can attain the planetary system of the polestar, or Dhruvaloka, where Dhruva Mahārāja is presiding. He is a great devotee of the Lord, and he has a special planet which is called the polestar. ”
Prabhu Sam, since you are a Practitioner devotee / follower of our Jagat Guru HDG. Srila Prabhupada, I take this opportunity to discuss further on your comments which reads ; ” ….. the main difference between the Bhagavatam and Jyotish or astrology is that the 5th Canto cannot be used to calculate Ekadasi. Or any other holy day etc as there are no formulae given for calculating tithi etc.”
A Well Qualified Learned Jyotishi in this case the Rishi / Muni knows and understands very well about the Pal, Pehar and Tithi etc. according to the Planetary Position Calculation at the particular Time of everyday. For example, the Father of Srila Vayasadev knew the auspicious time at the conception of his birth on the day. Same goes for the Father of Ravana knew the UNAUSPICIOUS time at the conception of his birth. Both the incidents, the respective Mothers became aware of its resultant outcome which we all read from the Bhagavatam and other Vedic Literature. Is it NOT a FACT ?
Where is the difficulty calculating tithi for a Learned Person who is well versed in the Jyotish Vidya ?
Where is the difficulty to reconcile between the 5th Canto and the Jyotish calculation which are intertwined, if some one like yourself knows the Astrology well enough to read the Position of the Planetary Position in the Astral Sky which are described in the 5th Canto ?
As per my understanding, there should not be any problem to calculate the event because the Surya Siddhanata and 5th Canto explanation of the Cosmos go hand in hand.
Is my inference correct ? If not, then, feel free to correct me.
Make no mistake that that does not make me an expert in the Jyotish Vidya or 5th Canto knowledge. No. Not at all. My comments are based on the very basic understanding of the Sastras. What little knowledge of understanding of the Scripture I acquire daily is due to the Mercy of our Jagat Guru HDG. Srila Prabhupada’s VANI and His Sincere Followers / Devotees like yourself by discussing on the various topics such as this time to time. Otherwise, I have no any Spiritual Merit at all.
I am sorry to state that your vague explanation does not make any common sense AT ALL to me as described above for which I stand to be corrected.
OM TAT SAT.
Hare Krishna. All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.
Hare Krishna Amar Puri, here is a detailed list that I prepared earlier. Please forgive me for any mistakes. There will bound to be some, there always are in my work.
Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami and His translations and purports to Srimad-Bhagavatam! All glories to Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati and His translations and annotations of Surya-Siddhanta and Siddhanta-Siromani (as Bimala Prasad Datta)! All glories to both Prabhupadas!
First, I wish to make it clear that I am comparing at least two or three systems here – (1) Puranic cosmology, and (2) astronomy, both (i) eastern (Vedic/Jyotisha) and (ii) western, including (iii) astrology, using both the sidereal and tropical zodiacs. So there is a fair amount of subject matter to reconcile. Also I would like to acknowledge that as Bimal Prasad Datta was awarded the title Bhaktisiddhānta for his work on the Siddhantas before he accepted Abhay Charan De as his disciple (later A. C. Bhaktivedānta Swami), we therefore we cannot dismiss the Siddhantas just because they present a different perspective to the Bhagavatam, as both scriptures have commentaries authored by both Prabhubadas.
Regarding the differences between Puranic cosmology (the Bhagavatam) and astronomy including both zodiacs (sidereal and tropical) of Vedic Jyotish (the Siddhantas) and Western systems (astronomy and astrology) we encounter an apparent paradox. Surya-Siddhanta, Siddhanta-Siromani and astronomy/astrology are by and large the same, apart from any minor difference between nomenclature and the use of geocentric or heliocentric systems – superficially the geometry may differ but the respective calculations result in the same outcomes for both systems. For the purposes of making observations and erecting charts and horoscopes using the motions and positions of the heavenly bodies there is no technical argument therein. It must be made clear that Puranic cosmology does not deal with any of that – for example Ekadasi is calculated using the jyotisha of the Siddhantas, not the cosmology of the Bhagavatam!
Using scriptual knowledge and impirical information to arrive at an intellectual and philosophical understanding is bona fide and not the same thing as wild mental speculation about mundane affairs. In fact, one is always encouraged to use one’s brain to understand instead of just parroting things like a robot! Inquisitiveness coupled with healthy scepticism may open many a door locked to even the most pedantic lover of doctrinal dogma.
Personally, in comparing cosmology to astronomy I wouldn’t have expected that our solar system could be mathematically reckoned to a cosmological universe. But in researching this I happened to stumble across one possible explanation – Demigod Yojanas! We already know that demigod time is different to Earth Time – so why not distance as well? After all, time and space are both ‘dimensions’. Read on if you’re interested…
In astronomy the approximate figure of 4 billion miles for the Sun/Pluto distance is a radius, whereas the roughly 4 billion miles wide universe quoted in cosmology is a diameter. This makes our Solar System twice larger at 8 billion miles wide. So, aren’t we trying to compare chalk and cheese here? Something else must be going on.
Before we get to the concept of demigod yojanas…. this is not the place to argue about Flat Earth, Moon Landing hoax, fake NASA, etcetera etcetera. Do that somewhere else and at another time. Sticking to what is relevant here, first we must acknowledge that the SB 5th Canto Chapter 22 is a minefield of typos! I will no doubt be accused of fault-finding but really I am just trying to get to the bottom of this and the truth. What I want to bring attention to here (rather than to nit-pick) is that the confusion caused by differences in the two models (cosmology vs astronomy both eastern and western) is compounded many times over by the errata and typos in the 5th Canto.
Although eastern and western astronomy closely align, if we compare the three models they don’t match up, and we’re used to that. For example, Lord Brahma’s planet Satyaloka at the top of the cosmological universe, being some 2 billion miles above the Sun, would work out to be closer than our astronomical Pluto at roughly 4 billion miles out. This doesn’t make any sense – two completely different sized models.
Now… add in the typos and see how even more confusing it becomes!
Take Śanaiścara (Saturn) for example. Using the texts from SB 5.22.8-16 or Chart Three at the front of the volume we find that Saturn is 1.3 million yojanas (10.4 million miles) above the Sun in the text – yet from Chart Three it is 1.4 million (11.2 million).
Which one is it?
Alas, the figure given by western astronomers is over 70 times that, around 886 million miles, illustrating the vast difference in the sizes of the two models. Adding Pluto to that equation emphasises that even more so.
Now… SB 5.22.8 re Sun/Moon distance clearly states ‘lakṣa-yojanataḥ’ and in the translation 100,000 yojanas…
… yet in Chart Three we find the Moon drawn above the Sun by 200,000 yojanas – not 100,000!
Which one is it?
Nowhere in the slokas or translated verses do we see the Sun referenced as 100,000 yojanas above the Earth. We only see it using the chart (you may also be able to find in English in a purport) but I cannot find that figure anywhere in Sanskrit or the translation – even using online search tools! Why did Śrīla Prabhupāda use NASA’s figure of 93,000,000 miles in the purports? And anyway 800,000 miles is nothing like the 93 million miles we are all familiar with.
Which one is it?
It is a mystery where the unnamed artist who drew the Chart Three obtained the figure of 100,000 yojanas from for the Earth/Sun distance (perhaps Vishnu Purana?). It’s not in the slokas or the translated verses, and can only arrived at by working backwards from the 4 million miles stated in the weird Text 11 purport which comes from the incorrect distances found in Chart Three. Very confusing!
Further investigation led me to realise just how astronomical the size difference (pun intended) of the two models is, the cosmological universe being a mere fraction of the astronomical universe that uses Light-years to measure vast distances (six trillion, or 6,000,000,000,000 miles approx = 1 light-year).
I do remember reading elsewhere that a yojana is a relative measurement – which may or may not account for the discrepancy between the two sizes of universe ie Earth vs Demigod yojanas – also it has various values ie 8 miles, 5 miles or 8 kilometres, etc as used by different Jyotish practitioners. ‘As far away as a bull can be heard bellowing’ and ‘as far as one can see clearly’ are two examples I have also come across for 1 yojana. Perhaps a yojana means one thing in outer space and another in a paddock? Or a more feasible explanation as one author suggests, is that in the same way that Demigod time is different to Earth time (eg one day of Brahma equals 4.32 billion Earth years) perhaps a Demigod yojana is much, much bigger than an Earth yojana!
https://m.facebook.com/VedicCosmology/posts/our-universe-is-4-billion-miles-in-size-but-is-that-demigod-size-or-earth-size-k/1652037028437556/
This actually makes a lot of sense to me in a way when I take the time to ponder the possibility. For quite some time I have agreed with Richard L. Thompson’s view that Vedic Cosmology is described as seen from the Heavenly Planets – perhaps why it seems so perplexing to us. It is no wonder Vedic Cosmology has confused devotees and scholars the whole world over when we try to impose Earth value systems upon it.
We have all heard the expression “Too many cooks spoil the broth”. There was more than one editor who worked on Bhagavad-Gītā As It Is, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam and similar works with the Devanagari, romanised Sanskrit, transliterations, translations, and purports and I think it is safe to say that some have made a few mistakes here and there, as we are all human. This is separate from any confusion caused by any measurement of spatial differences.
Personally I have no objection to the numerous typos in Śrīla Prabhupāda’s books – and I am certainly not criticising Him. Not only do I not mind them, I value them – as they provide a valuable function! These typos serve to identify His Divine Grace’s original books because they have since been removed from the edited, so-called ‘corrected’ and changed modern BBTi versions.
Besides, most of the typos are so glaringly obvious as mistakes that they generally don’t cloud any meaning. Forr eximple, you moste probbly hav no diffculity unda standing wot this sentence meenz. Similarly with figures, when different numbers describe the same phenomena (such as 10,000 yojanas and 1,000,000 yojanas for the same distance of Siddhaloka below Rahu) we can do the sums in our head and work out with simple arithmetic, which one is correct.
Distances between planets in 5th Canto, Book Two, Chart Three differ not only from the texts – the texts differ from the purports. Even the heavenly bodies change names in some places! It is no wonder Vedic Cosmology has devotees confused the world over. It definitely seems to have confused the editors, proof-readers and typesetters!
Using both the search engines built into Vanipedia and Gitabase as well as reading and skimming through the actual 5th Canto, I cannot find a single Sanskrit reference to the 100,00 yojana distance between the Earth and the Sun anywhere in the texts (either in the Devanagari script, the Sanskrit, the transliterations, or nor the English translation of the Sanskrit). It appears in Chart Three as 100,000 yojanas; elsewhere in English in the purports varying as either 100,000 yj or 93 million miles; yet not a single mention in the actual Sanskrit slokas – at least not in the 5th canto which deals with our position in the material universe in detail.
Now, some of you might gloss over my pedantry as being trivial. But as having a western-type triple Virgo symbolism I was born to focus on these sorts of things. If it exists somewhere else in Sanskrit I would be very grateful if someone can show me where – IN SANSKRIT – in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, the Earth/Sun distance is (I am NOT referring to in the English in the purports). As far as I can see there is no reference IN SANSKRIT to either 100,000 yojanas nor 93 million miles which is a NASA figure. I would be very happy to be proven wrong, please do!
When using the search tools built into Vedabase, Gitabase and Vanipedia, with the words “Sun”, “Earth”, “distance”, “above” in quotation marks – even including the Boolean term AND between them to narrow down the results – I didn’t find ANYTHING in the actual Sanskrit-to-English text. There are plenty of references everywhere else but they all use figures based on western astronomy, not Vedic. I guess this is why Śrīla Prabhupāda uses the 93,000,000 figure. As far as I could fathom the actual figure of 100,000 yojanas (or 800,000 miles) comes from the Viṣṇu Purana, not the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.. but that still doesn’t explain how 100,000 yojanas found its way into Chart Three mistakenly as double that figure.
So we have these unusual entries:
#1. SB 5.22.8, the Moon is listed as 100,000 yj above the Sun; whereas in Chart Three it is drawn as 200,000 yj;
#2. SB 5.22.11 is an absolute ripper of an example of errata and typos in 3 ways. The bold text says that the 28 Stars are 1,600,000 miles above the Moon, yet in the purport it reads “above the Sun”. The whole purport 5.22.11 says:
“The stars referred to herein are 1,600,000 miles above the sun, and thus they are 4,000,000 miles above the earth (sic).”
If we take the Earth/Sun distance as 800,000 miles (and ignore what is written elsewhere in SB about 93 million miles) it can only add up to 3.2 million. The distance of the 28 Stars above the Earth at 4 million miles only adds up using the Chart 3 distance of the Moon being 1,600,000 miles above the Sun instead of 800,000 as it the text. Therefore the 5.22.11 purport is wrong in three ways because it uses:
a. Double the Moon/Sun distance resulting in the wrong figure;
b. An unexplained figure of 100,000 yojanas for the Earth/Sun distance found nowhere but in the incorrect chart. Nowhere in the body of the text EXCEPT THE PURPORTS is the height of the Sun above the Earth given – and even then in other places it is 93 million miles; and
c. It says the sun and not the moon;
#3. SB 5.24 chapter introduction states re: Siddhaloka, etc are below Rahu “by another 1,000,000 yojanas” whereas 5.24.4 says only 10,000 yojanas;
#4. Chapter 24 goes on to say that the seven Subterranean planets, each the same size as Earth, are 10,000 yj apart. Chart Three shows them situated as starting at 70,000 yj beneath the Earth (which is about 1,000 yojanas diameter according to Surya-Siddhanta). This is also summarised previously in the last verse 5.23.9 which says 30,000 yj below the subterranean planets lies the Garbhodaka ocean some 130,000 yj below Earth. None of this adds up when looking at Chart Three.
The only way anyone can interpret subterranean as meaning ‘inside hollow Earth’ is obviously by taking its meaning literally and disregarding the arithmetic. They can’t all be the same size as Earth and yet fit inside it! Yes, ‘subterranean’ means ‘below the crust of the Earth”, as in underground – but certainly not below the Earth’s plane which is the context in which it appears to be used! Perhaps an overzealous editor substituted or suggested the word not knowing the correct context of ‘subterranean’?
These are just a few typos that I found by double-checking a few chapters of just one book. My point is, the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is wonderful, but regarding these minor discrepancies, anyone who takes EVERYTHING they read literally, especially the multitude of contradictions in the 5th Canto, is sure to be getting the wrong picture. Perhaps they spent a little too much time experimenting in Haight-Ashbury during the 60s? Maybe that explains how some people can accommodate both a Flat Earth and a Hollow Earth at the same time…
From what I have read, besides Giriraj who was very qualified and did most of the editing and proofing before anything was sent to the printers, there were others who at various times may have ‘helped’ eg typed, copied manuscripts, dotted the i’s and crossed the t’s etcetera to get everything ready for printing. We take it as a given that the Devanagari script, Sanskrit romanisation, word-for-word transliteration, and all the text translations were all done by highly qualified and experienced people. You will be hard-pressed to find any mistakes there.
It is in the purports that we invariably find all the discrepancies, not just typographical errors, for in some places the information is for the wrong sloka, partially scrambled, or completely incorrect, rendering it very confusing to the reader. This is where I suspect some garden-variety editors made very human mistakes.
We all agree that Śrīla Prabhupāda’s Bhagavad-Gītā As It Is and Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam are masterpieces. As I have said before, the typos that they do contain help identify them as the originals because subsequent edited and altered editions don’t have them. Therefore they serve a valuable purpose rather than detract from the greater body of work.
No-one can deny that human error has crept into the editing of SP’s books. These listed typos are proof of that. Yet it does not stop us from marvelling at these most sacred of scriptures.
In your service,
Sam
Hare Kṛṣṇa
हरे कृष्ण
Due to time differences it appears that my lengthy post was a reply to the previous comment but this is not the case – I hadn’t read it as it had not yet been published. I was merely elaborating on my original comment with additional detailed information.
Thank you,
Ys Sam.
Dear Sam ,
AGTSP. PAMHO.
I am very much disappointed to state that you have not addressed any of the QUESTIONS of concerns I did put forth to you for the ANSWERS in my comments.
You are simply hiding the TRUTH in your philosophical speculation with the contradictory explanation based on so called imperfect empirical understanding on the subject matter by you as well as the others mundane scholars which is subject to four defects.
Informatively, I may mention that there are so many explanations on the subject matter of the Cosmos as explained in the 5th Canto clearly describing that the explanations such as yours in the comments as stated are totally speculative and contradictory for which there is no need at all to repeat it to prove that your explanation is misleading from the point of view of the Sastras. You can search on this web site various topics as discussed elsewhere which proves my point.
Further I may remind you that you wrote elsewhere in your comments ; ” The 5th is something else, possibly reflecting the viewpoint from the Heavenly planets of the demigods. ”
Therefore, I did pose my QUESTIONS to you in the comments for which you did not even bother to reply to it at all.
That is the reason also I said as well in my reply ;
” That is why we the conditioned JIVAS have to rise to the Platform of Devas in order to understand the 5th Canto. Otherwise, you can not make such NON-SENSE comments with your whimsical mind which are of no value.”
Contradictory explanations and the translations – interpretations done by the non-bona fide philosophical scholars always mislead and thus, it serves no learning purpose furthering to understand the Sastras what the bona fide Acarayas say.
I am sorry once again to state that your contradictory explanation of accepting and rejecting from the Sastras does not make any common sense AT ALL to me.
OM TAT SAT.
Hare Krishna. All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.
… from Cow Urin to Astrologie…on to Sanskrit and Mathematics…
(courtesy of the email round letter of Krsna Balaram Swami)
BHAGAVAT DHARMA SAMAJ
Institute for Pure Devotional Service
Astrology is a mathematical science
jyotisam ayanam saksad
yat taj jnanam atindriyam
praniam bhavata yena
puman veda paravaram
Translation
The knowledge which is beyond the grasp of men, that science of astrology, is prepared by you, and due to that knowledge, the humans of this world are able to know the inconceivable traditional science.
Purport
Everyone wonders what they did in their previous lives. One thing is certain. One’s present life is the result of one’s previous deeds. Every auspicious and inauspicious activity that one performed in his previous life comes in the form of happiness or distress in this life. The science which studies the events of our past, present, and future lives in detail is called astrology. As it is stated in the Jataka Cintamani, vyanjayati sastram etat-tamasi dravyani dipa iva, “The scripture which gives the knowledge of one’s unknown circumstances, like a lamp giving light, is called astrology.” As Parasari Hora states, saphalam jyotisam sastram candrarkau yatra saksinau, “As long as the sun and the moon witness this world, the science of astrology will remain true.” This means that the science of astrology, if handled properly, will remain intact until the annihilation of this creation.
Astrology is a mathematical science and, if learned in traditional Gurukul schools which teach in the Sanskrit language, one is able to use it to tell about one’s past and present and predict the future. If the science is not learned correctly, its result is like that of a calculation of mathematics, in which a perfect procedure is used to answer the question, but the decimal point is put in a wrong place. Although it is a perfect science, in modern days astrologers often fail to predict events correctly because they have not been taught the science properly.
There are nine planets, fifteen tithis (lunar days), twenty seven constellations, twelve rasiis (zodiac signs), twelve karanas (assistants), twenty eight yogas (time factors), two fortnights, eight yoginis (female attendants of the directions), eight directions and the visottary-dasa (the yearly travel of the planets through the zodiac houses) and antar-dasa (the monthly dominance of each planet in a particular zodiac house) in astrology. These factors, if calculated correctly, can tell about one’s past, present and future.
Nanda Maharaja, with his pleasing words, encourages Garga Muni to perform the name-giving ceremony to predict the future of his sons Krsna and Balaram through astrological calculations, and to interpret their physical marks. The word saksat, used in this verse by Nanda Maharaja, signifies that, although others have to learn the scriptures from a qualified Guru following the traditional guidelines, Garga Muni not only knows the science perfectly, but he also has compiled it for others. The word paravaram, used in reference to Garga Muni, stands for material and spiritual sciences, both of which he has expounded. He wrote on the science of astrology, which is material, and he wrote the Garga Samhita, which is the science of spiritualism explaining the intricate pastimes of Lord Krsna.
—Srimad Bhagavatam 10.8.5, Translation and Purport by His Divine Grace Mahamandaleshwar Mahant Sri Krsna Balaram Swami
Thanks for sharing the letter, mohini d.d. Prabhu.
Mahamandaleshwar Mahant Sri Krsna Balaram Swami seems to forget in his explanation that first of all, there is no disciplic succession in the School of Jyotish Vidya from which the Proper Science of Astrology can be learned. The Link is broken. Therefore, there is no qualified Teacher (Tri Kaal Giani ) who can interpret simply by looking at the Astral Sky as I mentioned as an examples of the Rishi / Munis in my comments.
However, whatever little mention of the Astrology in the Vedic Literature is available, unfortunately, there is NO True Learned Practitioners who can 100% accurately read through the events taking place in this age of Kali Yuga. Therefore, there are so many different deluded theories and interpretations are out there and as a result of that the accuracy of the readings are challenged left, right and centre. Thus, loosing the potency of the Science of Astrology by its mis-interpretations create conflicts which misleads people.
Make no mistake, there is indeed through the Empirical System Approach to the analysis to the Science of Astrology which are being practised by which some satisfactory results are obtained.
I read by the Web Master that he does not want commentary to continue on this topic, but, I think that it becomes imperative to share this vital message with the interested Readers. I hope the Web Master considers to publish it.
Hare Krishna. All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.
After being diagnosed as lactose intolerant over a decade ago “because of my bad karma” (coeliac disease) I have been drinking lactose free milk with good results ever since. AFAIK there is no A2 lactose-free milk on the market as yet.
The alternative is to purchase one’s own lactase, the enzyme that breaks down the sugurs into digestible lactulose and galactose. It takes a few days after adding the enzyme for the sugars to break down.
I often wonder if coeliac disease (and the intolerance to wheat, barley and rye) is a result of neglecting to observe ekadasi in some previous lifetime. Botge my youngest daughter and her mother have the condition and none of us were too averse to visiting Melbourne Mahaprabhu Mandir in the 90s.
With coeliac, the tips of the villi are damaged. This is the site where the lactase enzyme is produced. Coeliacs with damaged villi from ingestion of gluten often have impaired lactose absorption, resulting in Mt Vesuvius gas and fluid being ejected from the colon.
A1 milk and A2 present different situatuions, in the digestibility of the different proteins. The point of my blah blah blah is to draw attention to the fact that some may not be entirely aware of the differences and what is going on.
Gold standard for coeliac test: HLA-DQA1 and 2 genes, gluten antibodies blood test, gastroscopic biopsy of duodenum and small intestine.
I also had a PEG-400 test (polyethyl glycol) for intestinal permeability. I failed, meaning too small and too large sugar molecules were finding their way into my blood. This is not recognised by mainstream science apart from irregular gastrointestinal absorption. In fringe medicine this is labelled Leaky Gut Syndrome, a frequent outcome of both coeliac disease and lactose intolerance.
My point of all this ranting is that switching to A2 milk may not solve anything if there is an underlying condition.
Fun fact: my older brother, bless his heart, is a mayavadi and totally intolerant of all dairy. I could not do that, ever. I’d rather die than give up dairy!
Dear Samsbanned, thanks for your input.
You may know already but just in case you don’t. I read an article about glyphosate contributing to coeliac disease. Here is the link.
Wishing the best for your health 🙏
https://www.naturaljournal.com/glyphosate-the-real-culprit-behind-gluten-intolerance/
PAMHO, AGTSP. Thanks for that Sundarananda Prabhu.
The linked article wasn’t about coeliac disease per se but gluten intolerance which is rather different (although certainly coeliacs do not tolerate gluten!). Roughly speaking there are three or four different similar but unrelated conditions. Coeliac disease is an autoimmune disorder in which anti-gluten antibodies attack healthy body tissue as well as targeting the gluten protein molecule. Then there is wheat allergy in which obviously there is an allergic reaction. Lastly there is gluten intolerance, separate and not the same in which there is neither an allergic reaction or an antibody response. That condition is grouped under NCGS or NCWS, Non-coeliac Gluten Or Wheat Sensitivity.
Coeliac Disease is almost entirely genetic, an inherited condition that may lie dormant or undiagnosed until an external trigger sets off an immune reaction. The external agent doesn’t cause CD, the disease is latent until it causes observable damage to the body’s tissues. The modern trend is for males over 50 now being diagnosed as awareness and testing increases. I am actually what’s called a ‘silent coeliac’ wherein I do not get sick from eating gluten – I used to gorge myself at the temple on farina halava, chapatis, puris, samosas etc – but nevertheless damage to the villi in the small intestine occurs and only shows up through microscopic examination of a biopsy. With that comes a whole lot of medical conditions including vitamin and mineral deficiencies from poor absorption from the stunted villi, increased liability to certain cancers and inflammatory diseases – otitis media (earache), arthritis, hives, tonsilitis, etc and a stack of other things.
Since adopting a gluten-free diet the huge difference I notice is mental clarity, memory, ability to concentrate and a general clearing of the gluten-induced brain fog. It is truly amazing as I grow older to observe the difference in acuity and comprehension compared to when I was young (I failed school). As for lactose-free dairy, mature age people in general benefit as their aging bodies lose the ability to secrete the lactase enzyme necessary to break down the lactose into easily digestible lactulose and galactose.
I recommend that anyone especially those of advanced years who are experiencing digestive issues with dairy-based prasadam to try switching to lactose-free recipes. They cost a little more to prepare but are acceptable to offer to Their Lordships. As far as I know there is no A2 lactose-free milk available on the market so you’d have to obtain some of the lactase enzyme and convert the A2 milk in your home, it takes about a day.
I hope that helps.
Hare Kṛṣṇa
Ys Sam
Many in my family nephews, nieces, brothers, daughter etc have some problems with dairy. Even A2 milk is a problem for most of them, so the A2 will not solve this as some have severe conditions like IBS and Crohns. I was lucky not to get this problem which is gene related (and also Karmic) so I can drink both A1 and A2. If I drink A1 sometimes I will get a pain in the Solar Plexis area but it is not severe (this is indicating some difficulty in digestion of A1 protein) so when the A2 came onto the market I noticed a vast improvement in flavour (it is ‘sweeter’ with a creamy aftertaste) and no more stomach aches.
So it is true that those with underlying conditions, the A2 may not make any noticeable difference as both A1 and A2 contain lactose.
PAMHO, AGTSP Prabhus.
A quick rundown on lactose (milk sugar) and lactose malabsorption (often mislabelled intolerance).
Normally the villi in the small intestine secrete the enzyme LACTASE which breaks down lactose into the more readily digested lactulose and galactose. These sugars are then absorbed in the small intestine (lactose ALWAYS passes through the SI as its large molecular size prevents it entering the Tight Junctions of the bowel wall).
When there is a deficiency of lactase, the unabsorbed lactose then passes into the large intestine where all manner of hell breaks out. The undigested milk sugar attracts water (causing diarrhoea) and creates gas (bloating, flatulence) thus causing considerable pain.
As we age even healthy villi lose some of their ability to create lactase. As well, coeliacs often have villous atrophy (stunted, damaged) to begin with and this only gets worse with age. So even non-coeliacs can get trouble from the sugars in milk, a totally separate issue to the A1 and A2 proteins.
For those who have just discovered lactose-free dairy products it can be quite the epiphany being able to enjoy kheer, burfi, panir and sandesh in unlimited quantities with absolutely no discomfort whatsoever. It saves on laundry as well ha ha ha. No more dashes to the dunny! The hardest part of all this is sourcing lactose-free ingredients. Milk, soft and hard cheeses, yoghurt and confectionery can all be easily obtained. I’m yet to find LF powdered milk or butter for simply wonderfuls though.
(#fermented milk products lose lactose content as they age as the bacteria feeds on the milk sugar. Therefore hard cheese has very little but cottage cheese and sour cream still have a lot. When making ghee the solids hold the lactose. It’s also mainly in the whey when making curd)
I hope that helps someone
Ys Sam
हरे कृष्ण
Sam Prabhu: “I’m yet to find LF powdered milk, or butter for simply wonderfuls though”.
With regards to butter, the best way to make it is from churning yoghurt, not cream as they do in the West.
We read in Krishna Book (10th Canto Srimad Bhagavatam) that the gopis make the butter this way. Butter made in this way is available at specialist gourmet outlets but is very expensive but more beneficial for those with an intolerance as the ‘lactose’ is converted during the process of making the yoghurt.
When the yoghurt is churned into butter it loses the lactose (by bacterial process) but retains the beneficial enzymes of the yoghurt, making digestion easier.
Thank you very much Sudarsana Prabhu. Yes I remember reading that somewhere before and now putting it all together I have realised that because most of the lactose is transported into the whey in making the yoghurt and furthermore in the buttermilk from churning, it is not in the butter made properly that way.
Alas, I don’t have a cow and are far too lazy to do it that way…. because I tolerate butter well. I guess even commercially produced butter must be fairly low in lactose as well.
Hare Kṛṣṇa
Ys Sam
हरे कृष्ण
Further comments should kindly focus on article topic “I drink cow urine every day”. Thank you.